Recently, I became the proud owner of a Flux C500. Before that, I had only briefly ridden two different trikes in Mainz. I had a queasy feeling about buying a single-track vehicle without experience and then immediately riding 12 km home. It went great – three short laps in a parking lot and I was already willing to hit the road (by the way: contrary to my expectations, I haven't fallen yet – the C500 rides stable and I feel safe). Already on the way home, I had some initial ideas for modifications that I now want to implement step by step. I would like to use this thread as documentation and I welcome hints, tips, and criticism.
To Flux – what is it about:
- front 20", rear 26"
- Gearing: 72 speeds – 3 sprockets on the crank without derailleur (manual operation) & Dualdrive with 3-speed hub gear and 8-speed chain gear (Deore LX)
- Tires: Marathon Slick
- Lighting system with side runner dynamo
- Rim brake, mirror left, bell right, dynamo, typical beech wood seat with foam seat, luggage rack
Recently it is about:
What else should be about:
- Rohloff
- Hub dynamo
- Bottle holder?
- Deeper bell (too quiet and too shrill)
- different seat?
Is it wise to make major modifications before the first 1000km? Right with the first recumbent bike? No idea. I just notice that I feel uncomfortable with the side runner dynamo, but basically want to ride with lights.
Hub Dynamo
At Kurbelix (and of course with other providers) there is everything possible from Shimano to SON via Shutter on a Ryde Andra 40. I can't find any sensible offers on the bay right now. It would make sense not to order blindly, but to first pay attention to whether the installation width is correct.
Circuit
I can't handle derailleur gears. And with 72 gears, I'm easily overwhelmed, especially since there is no front derailleur on the crank. On the tandem and trekking bike, I ride with Rohloff and am absolutely satisfied with it. So why not install a unit from Kassel here as well? Several question marks pop up here: Which Rohloff type should it be? How is the hub mounted on the frame? Does it need a torque support? Which axle type, ... Does a used purchase make sense here or should I rather save for a new Rohloff? The spare and accessory parts from Rohloff also add up a bit in the end ... After that, I should urgently deal with the gear ratio question. If that's not right, riding is significantly less fun.
Bottle holder and bell
I will postpone these two points a little. The frame has no eyelets for a bottle holder. I don't want to unnecessarily drill into the wooden seat yet; I might just stop to drink. Or I can drink from a hydration bladder in a saddlebag. I can replace the bell in the meantime; maybe my cellar has something nice.
Seat
Recumbent cycling is comfortable. Everyone says that, and I gladly agree. Still, I have the feeling of sweating on the foam seat on my back. That's probably normal too. Maybe I'll try a different seat sometime.
Nevertheless, I feel like I'm sweating on the foam seat on my back. That's probably normal too.
There you can try out all the seats and will only find: Sweating on the back is normal and happens on every seat. A mat with spacer fabric - whether a simple slope mat or the noble Dutch product - will reduce sweating but such mats cannot completely eliminate it - neither can the best mesh seat. In 28 years of recumbent bikes/recumbent trikes and VMs, I have ridden 8 different mesh seats, 8 shell and wooden seats. Sweating on the back is part of it. In the first CB, I always only had a towel to absorb on the shell seat. The simple spacer fabric from Pedalkraft significantly improved the problem but eliminating it is impossible. I would therefore keep the seat - the Flux beech wood seats are already the best compromise between a stiff shell and ventilation, only the standard foam padding is "suboptimal". A hub dynamo would also be a must for me. I have cheap ones but also three SONs - I may not be a benchmark, but I don't feel any significant difference. Rohloff would be a must for me - only on the e-bike I don't have one. But I would first ride a piece before you change much. Maybe you will soon fall in love with another model. (Although I personally consider the C500 to be one of the best and most stable recumbent bikes and cannot understand why CUM has stopped production.)
C.
Does it make sense to buy used here or should I rather save for a new Rohloff?
I would recommend you to look for a used bike (Up) with Rohloff and hub dynamo (no matter which). If you get a 26" wheel, you only need to re-spoke the front wheel at first and you can - if you later want to switch to another recumbent - easily revert back and take the Rohloff for the next recumbent. Maybe ask directly at Flux which Rohloff variant is the right one? I have decided for my Flevo-Racer to switch to another gear system (from Shimano 7 to Alfine 11 or better Rohloff) only after 1,000 km, but I also mostly ride the Grasshopper (currently about 10 times as much). The earlier you switch, the longer you benefit from it! Have fun with the Flux and wishes you to become more secure.
wolf
Rohloff on the touring recumbent is already good. I would try to install one with external control. Does the C500 have a disc brake mount? Then the torque support goes through this. Otherwise, a screw axle also works - I had that on the SPM. If it absolutely has to be a NaDy, then a SON (for smaller wheels) would be my first choice. For "once in a while" I still have an Alfine NaDy for the SPM - but you definitely notice it on long distances! I have switched everything to battery/accumulator lighting except for the "train station slut".
LG Holger
Last edited: 19.10.2022
Wie denn? Ich fahre an allen Rädern immer mit Licht. Also merke ich da auch keinen Unterschied.
C.
I've been waiting for such a post - I can feel it. Period. I have done hundreds of roll tests that confirm it. At least 6 watts of light plus loss power are confirmed by relevant tests. Why do we have to discuss this over and over again? If you don't notice anything, that's fine! And if you always ride with lights on ALL wheels, you can't notice any difference... right? For me, it actually makes about a 1.5 km/h difference on long distances with lights. If you don't believe it, just check with Kreuzotter.
It's important to me. Those who don't care can gladly ride with NaDy - as I said, I only have one left at the train station bike. Because of the reliability in any weather.
Last edited: 20.10.2022
Wow – thank you very much for your answers. Now I have set a process in motion that will certainly keep me busy. I am quite excited.
Den Sitz lasse ich erstmal so wie er ist. Die Beschreibung und Bestätigung von @Carsten K. war da sehr hilfreich. Aber abwarten und ggf. auf ein anderes Modell wechseln möchte ich nicht. Ich hab das Flux ja jetzt da, genieße es und schraube ein wenig rum, um das Fahrgefühl noch angenehmer zu machen. Was mir als nächstes über den Weg fährt sehe ich dann
Beim gebrauchten Rohloff-Kauf war ich sehr unsicher. Die Angebote in der Bucht sind sehr überschaubar und teils nicht attraktiv. Wie gut, dass mich eine PN erreichte und mir ein attraktives Angebot unterbreitet hat. Bilder folgen, wenn ich mich ans Einspeichen setzen werde
After consulting with Flux, a CC EX, 135mm fits into the C500. I'm still unsure if I need a special dropout. I still need to read a bit about that. However, I only want to lace it once. Hopefully, I find a nice offer for a 20-inch front wheel with hub dynamo. I generally like to ride with lights. I'm happy to accept the power loss because it makes me feel safer. There are plenty of debates about resistance and power loss. But that's not my topic (until a few months ago, I thought that the power loss was gone when I turned off the lamp^^ I then dropped out of the formulas with the Kreuzotter).
Could I theoretically use the front wheel with hub dynamo from a 20-inch children's bike, or would it bend because I am only a child internally and no longer externally?
Could I theoretically use the front wheel with hub dynamo from a 20-inch children's bike or does it bend...
It's hard to assess this in general terms, as there are highly varying qualities and also spoke counts. However, one can generally say that 20-inch wheels (with proper spoke tension) are significantly more stable than one might think. Even with 32 or even 28 spokes, although I would recommend 32 for the front wheel of the recumbent. But you should definitely adjust the tires to the high weight that rests on the front wheel - the "children's tires" are not up to the necessary standard!
LG Holger
Last edited: 20.10.2022
whereas I would already recommend 32 for the short-term tenant in VR.
Decently laced 20'' wheels can also manage with fewer spokes. On the BikeE (admittedly: very lightly loaded front wheel), 18 spokes held my hundred kilos. On the BikeE E2 tandem, I laced the hub dynamo with 28 spokes. Here, the front wheel actually carries the entire weight of the captain, while the stoker puts more load on the rear wheel. There were never any problems. The wheels were each laced by Pedalkraft - until now, I have never had a spoke break with any wheel from Pedalkraft. C.
Decently laced 20'' wheels...
That's exactly what I meant. Emphasizing that I can't know whether the mentioned VR "from a kid's bike" is also "properly" laced. If 28 spokes are "well done", meaning for example not crossed too often and maybe also sitting in a punctured rim, then they will of course hold... but that's probably not to be expected with a kid's bike. Maybe there are even fewer spokes... Caution is the mother of the porcelain box - especially when I'm building for other people or giving advice... p.s: As far as I remember, I've only read good things about the wheels from Pedalkraft.
LG Holger
Last edited: 20.10.2022
I also ride a first generation son hub dynamo in my c500, compared to the 20-inch children's bike from Böttcher, the spokes are already thicker. The rim also seems more stable and of higher quality. While browsing the offers on the internet, I spontaneously saw several complete 20-inch wheels with hub dynamo. If you don't have a top rim now, re-spoking almost makes no sense. With the gearing, you need to know a little about what you want; I think with the dual drive you should actually cover everything. I ride a 3x7, where I usually ride on the 2 in front... Sometimes I miss downshifting while standing... How often have I already been in a high gear at the traffic light. Otherwise, the c500 is a super good-natured recumbent, it can also be fast, the workouts come with it. I mounted horns below the grips. This way, you can also just rest your palm, the bike runs quite well straight ahead. At first, I had puncture-proof Marathon tires on, as they are optimized for straight ahead and are rather pointed in cross-section, cornering was a nasty tipping edge. I then switched to the Marathon Supreme, which is nice and round. It is significantly better in corners.
Bastian
Decently laced 20'' wheels can also manage with fewer spokes. On the BikeE (admittedly: very lightly loaded front wheel) 18 spokes held my hundred kilos. On the BikeE E2 tandem, I had the hub dynamo laced with 28 spokes.
Here on the folding bike too. 28 spokes in a simple, non-punctured box rim. Technically, that's not a problem. It's still crap because I now have a special oddity in the fleet again. Unfortunately, I can't just swap for something with 36 spokes because the folding bike needs a particularly narrow front hub. There's nothing but NaDy with 36 spokes.
uphill, when I declare what I wish for the creators of such 'masterpieces', I get a writing ban...
The Flux is great! I now ride a few kilometers every day. Unfortunately, not as much as I would like because I'm still trying to get rid of a cold. But compared to my "normal" bike (a sporty trekking bike), I'm about as fast. A few days ago, I was riding the Flux at 20 km/h – it's still the first kilometers – today I rode at 25-30 km/h. Apparently, I'm getting rid of the cold, and with every kilometer I ride, I feel more confident. Still, I'm a bit wobbly when starting. Often, I make a mini swerve. This is especially strange in city traffic at the traffic light when cars are standing next to me on the left and right. One thing I definitely have to get used to is the sunlight. With the Up, I have the visor of my helmet, which can shield the glaring sun rays a bit. On the recumbent bike, that doesn't work because my head is in a completely different position. Even with sunglasses, the sun really blinded me today. Riding with clipless pedals works really well. I was skeptical about whether I could unclip in time in city traffic. However, since I've already accumulated several thousand kilometers with clipless pedals on the Up, that's not a problem. On the contrary – it really feels more relaxed. When I ride with normal shoes, the sole of my foot is tense – it feels strange after 10 minutes. Maybe that's also because I haven't yet adjusted the Flux ideally to myself. Tomorrow, I will adjust the bottom bracket further. The feeling of sweating on the recumbent is still something to get used to. Of course – I still have to get used to the different position. But when I rode to a meeting yesterday, I was unsure whether I had sweated through my shirt in the back or not. Are there actually rain covers for the seat? Here in Rüsselsheim, it never seems to rain, but now in autumn, a few drops can still fall from time to time. Regarding my modification plans: I am in talks with my local bike shop. They will get me a few supplies. If all goes well, I can lace the Rohloff in the week after next.
I am still unsure whether I need special dropouts. I will attach pictures of the rear frame to this post – maybe someone with Flux experience has tips (maybe @bergsprint?).
Since I will be making both wheels new, the question about the braking system naturally arose. However, I fear that I will stick with the rim brake. A disc brake system is just too expensive for me right now. Additionally, I have little experience with disc brakes – my fleet is completely equipped with rim brakes.
The idea of @BastianUE with the horns as a shelf seems interesting to me – maybe I can try that out in the next few days.
When shifting, you need to know a bit about what you want, I think with the dualdrive you should actually cover everything, I ride a 3x7 where I usually ride in front on 2.... I sometimes miss downshifting while standing...
How often have I already been in a high gear at the traffic light.
The Dualdrive transmission is actually sufficient - at least so far on my few dozen kilometers here in the flat. However, since I am spoiled with shifting while stationary, I find it really hard to get used to the derailleur. Is it decadent to install a Rohloff in a new bike right away? Maybe. But I just love riding the can.
I am still unsure whether I need special dropouts. I will attach pictures of the rear end to this post – maybe someone with Flux experience has tips (maybe @bergsprint?).
Moin @Trumscheit, should fit like this. Same dropout on my Flux, with the two holes for the brake caliper mount for disc brakes. Speedbone is included. Fits in the two holes. The support via OEM axle plate fits perfectly. You could also just use an M6 screw and OEM2 axle plate if the Speedbone is too much hassle for you.
As a rain cover for the seat, a simple backpack cover will do. You can find it for a few euros in any store that also sells backpacks. C.
Kurzer Zwischenstand:
Zum Schrauben bin ich noch nicht gekommen, dafür wird der November aber lang genug sein. Einiges an Material ist unterwegs und wartet darauf dann von mir am Flux montiert zu werden. Neben meinem Schreibtisch liegt bereits die rote Rohloffnabe von @bergsprint , die ich einspeichen werde. Ich kann es kaum erwarten Es ist nicht schön zu hören, wie ich die Kettenschaltung malträtiere - da bin ich wirklich sehr grob und erbarmungslos.
A completely new topic for me is the knees. There have already been some discussions about this here. Long pants, especially jeans, press on my knee and cause me to really feel my knees later. On the Up, knees have never been an issue, even after 200 daily kilometers my knees were always in great shape. Maybe I'll chime in on the knee discussion again.
Wow, time has flown by in a flux. A lot has happened in the last few months. But it was worth it: - hub dynamo now powers a nice IQ XS in front.
- the radiant red Rohloff is laced and has replaced the Dualdrive. Shifting is now (as usual) a dream. A thousand thanks again @bergsprint
I am still somewhat unhappy with the three chainrings in the front. The Flux has no derailleur, so I have to shift manually on brutal climbs. So far, this has not been the case, as the gear ratio is currently quite good. Now I am eagerly collecting kilometers and hope to be able to ride through a night as soon as possible. It must be significantly more relaxed on the recumbent than on an upright.
ToDo for the summer: Organize water supply. Either with a drinking hose from a saddlebag or attach the hydration backpack to the backrest. Also, a rain cover wouldn't be bad - I need to check which size is good - further up (@Carsten K.) a backpack cover was recommended ;-)
